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Qualität des Beitrags: Beteiligte Poster: Sqwert Forum: http://beam.to/mightfish Forenbeschreibung: Knights of Goldshire - The Forum aus dem Unterforum: Hunter Antworten: 3 Forum gestartet am: Mittwoch 05.07.2006 Sprache: englisch Link zum Originaltopic: Hunter Rocketscience - How weapon speed relates into DPS Letzte Antwort: vor 16 Jahren, 5 Monaten, 29 Tagen, 12 Stunden, 15 Minuten
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Re: Hunter Rocketscience - How weapon speed relates into DPS
Sqwert - 28.09.2006, 13:58Hunter Rocketscience - How weapon speed relates into DPS
How Weapon Speed relates to DPS ( Again, imba Copy Past )
Graph of how hunter DPS changes with weapon speed can be found here
http://photobucket.com/albums/d92/Lamhi … Ssmall.jpg
Introduction
So, we have concluted that Ashjre'thul leads to a HUGE damage increase over Rhok'delar because it's a slower weapon.
But how does weapon speed relate to damage? Are there ideal weapon speeds for hunters that allow you to fit the ideal number of auto-shots inbetween aimed shots? Are there hunter "sweet spots" in weapon speed?
Are there local maximums and minimums to hunter weapon speeds that allow a faster weapon to get more dps than a slower weapon? Is it always better to get a slower weapon than a faster weapon?
Methods
In order to answer this question, I came up with four models of hunter damage, which I further subdivided into 8 separate models that are all contained in a massive spreadsheet.
Here is the result of weapon speed vs DPS
http://photobucket.com/albums/d92/Lamhi … Ssmall.jpg
The graph above was derived with the following assumptions.
44dps bow, 15% speed increase quiver. 435 agility, 500 ranged attack power bonus other than agility (including hunter's mark and aspect of the hawk) crit chance of 25% with talents.
Now this DPS figure is obtained from the assumption that the weapon DPS and the DPS bonus from the hunter's ranged attack power, arrows, etc... ARE ALL THE SAME. The ONLY VARIABLE is weapon speed.
Models used
Four general models were used to determine this graph, the models will be discussed in further detail later on in the thread. They are
1. Arcane shot spam model with one rank of Quick Shot adjustment
2. "10 second rule" model for both ceiling and floor # of auto-shots
3. "9 second rule" model for both ceiling and floor # of auto-shots
4. "5 second rule" model reflecting decreased auto-shot time from improved arcane shot talent, both ceiling and floor # of auto-shots
Conclusions
This chart shows that there is a clear increase in dps with increase in weapon speed. (Although there are areas where the increase is minute)
There is a slight increase in dps as your weapon speed drops below 1.5 (this comes from quick shot) but this is negligible compared to the increase in dps from slower weapons.
You see that with a 3.3 speed weapon you have a dps of about 477, while with a 2.5 speed weapon this drops to 425. This means just the change in speed causes a 12% drop in DPS.
This means, carapace spine crossbow is a better ranged weapon than a striker's mark for a hunter.
Now this is something we all knew already. But here's something I found really interesting. I took out aimed shot out of the picture, and instead gave the hunter a free auto-shot after every multi-shot and I got this graph.
http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d92/L … out145.jpg
Now you see clear local maximums and local minimums for ranged weapon speeds!
You see that the optimum speed for a hunter weapon is 2.9 THE SPEED OF RHOK'DELAR!
If we take Aimed Shot out of the equation, suddenly we no longer have a simple equation of "slower is better", instead we have a more dynamic landscape in the hunter ranged weapon speed world!
I am about to say something that's going to be very unpopular, but this graph leads me to believe that Aimed Shot in its current form is bugged. It's not working as intended. With Aimed Shot in its current form, we are left with a simple equation of "slower is better" with no variety. If we take Aimed Shot out of the equation, hunters have a choice. They can choose slow weapons for maximum burst damage in PvP, optimum weapon speed for maximum PvE damage potential, or a fast weapon (2.3ish) to take advantage of weapon procs or for spell interrupt.
This also brings additional utility to attack speed increase enchants. Say you find a great bow but it's 3.0 speed. Then you can simply slap on a 1-2% attack speed increase enchant and have a large increase in dps!
If Aimed Shot and multi-shot are modified from the current form, and we receive a buff of some sort to compensate for this nerf, the hunter worldscape could become a lot more interesting.
My suggestion as to how to change it? Put aimed-shot and multi-shot on the same timer. Undo the nerf on mortal shots and bring it back up to 50%, add a free auto-shot after multi-shot (reset auto-shot timer), increase damage on arcane shot. This will still give hunters a really good burst damage potential, not affect most of PvP, and prevent aimed-shot spamming in PvE without nerfing hunter dps in PvE.
Assumptions made: Hunter has improved aspect of the hawk and barrage. Removing improved aspect of the hawk decreases ratio of dps for weapons with a lower than 1.3 speed (does not exist) Removing barrage decreases the upward sloping trend as weapon speed increases. Having 8 piece giantstalker bonus increases this upward sloping trend.
These are models of in-game experience, and should not be confused with actual occurrences in game. Achieving this kind of dps can only occur in special circumstances. The ratios will budge slightly with reaction time.
Re: Hunter Rocketscience - How weapon speed relates into DPS
Sqwert - 28.09.2006, 13:58How Quickshot factors in
How Quick Shot (Improved Aspect of the Hawk)factors in:
It increases ranged attack speed by 30% for 8 seconds. Each talent point gives you 1% chance of this activating.
For a Rhokdelar this reduces your ranged attack speed to 1.97 with a 15% quiver.
Lets take the 10 second hunter attack rotation model.
With a Rhokdelar, if you get a Quick Shot proc at ANY STEP of the model, it basically amounts to an extra auto-shot hit.
If you get a Quick Shot proc, you should always stick with the rotation and keep casting your aimed-shot.
The Quick Shot proc decreases your aimed-shot cast time. The aimed-shot is still an increase in damage. But you will get an extra auto-shot in afterwards.
With 5 points into improved aspect of the hawk, you have a 5% or 1 in 20 chance of this procing.
Your average rotation has 6 hits, this means you get 1 proc every 3.33 rotations. So one auto-shot gets added every 3.33 rotations, this is roughly a 4% increase in damage.
(492/12423) The Quick Shot increases the chances of another Quick Shot proc, but for all intents and purposes we can think of this as a 4% increase in damage.
This number does not change even if you are using an Ashjrethul. It is still about 4% and you still manage to get the extra attack in (just barely).
Re: Hunter Rocketscience - How weapon speed relates into DPS
Sqwert - 28.09.2006, 13:59How Rapid Fire Factors in
How Rapid Fire factors in
Rapid fire unlike Quick Shot is a 40% increase in ranged attack speed. I believe that this is about 1.87 seconds with a Rhok'delar (correct me if I am wrong)
If you activate Rapid Fire right after an aimed shot in the attack rotation, the next 15 seconds look something like this
Auto-shot, Auto-shot, Auto-shot, Auto-shot, Multi-shot, Auto-shot, Arcane-shot, Auto-shot, Auto-shot, Auto-shot, Auto-shot.
With this, you are saving the Arcane shot you get at the very end for an aimed shot after Rapid Fire runs out.
It comes out to be
9 auto-shot = 4428 damage
1 multi-shot = 637 damage
1 arcane-shot = 193 damage
Added together this is 5258 damage
or 350dps over those 15 seconds, which is still lower than our hunter 10 second attack rotation.
So it is still better to continue with the rotation with Rapid Fire activated. In fact aimed shot cast time is reduced by rapid fire.
The best use of Rapid Fire then comes with activating it at the end of one aimed shot, and getting the increased attack speed through two rotations. This gives you 2 extra attacks. Or 1000 damage over 15 seconds.
By using Rapid Fire right after you get a quick shot, you get 8 seconds of 1.37 attack speed followed by 1 extra attack in a normal attack rotation.
Your aimed shot cast time is reduced to about 1.6 or 1.7 seconds during that 8 second period. I am still not entirely sure whether it is better to use arcane shot or aimed shot in this situation, but I think aimed shot will give you more dps.
Although this depends heavily on when you get the Quick Shot proc, during those 8 seconds you get 6 auto-shots, 1 arcane-shot, and probably a multi-shot.
This is
6 auto shot = 6 * 492 = 2952
1 arcane shot = 193
1 multi-shot = 637
Total = 3782
DPS: ~473
On top of that you get 1 extra attack in your next rotation.
So in conclusion
If you get a quick shot proc, keep following the rotation.
Activate rapid fire after you get a quick shot proc (at a good spot in the rotation) if you can. After the 8 seconds of double proc is over, continue with the rotation for an extra attack from the rapid fire.
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